Neil Young News: Archives Volume 1 Pre-Order on Amazon, Seriously

Tuesday, October 28, 2008

Archives Volume 1 Pre-Order on Amazon, Seriously

Folks know that we've all been following The Neil Young Archives saga for many, many years.

Rumors float by. News comes and goes. Fans give up hope. Some pray for its release before their demise.

We all got pretty excited earlier this year with the announcement at the Sun JavaOne Conference Keynote with Neil Young.

So the latest is that the Neil Young Archives Volume 1 (1963 - 1972) 10 Disc Blue-Ray can now be pre-ordered on Amazon.com. (And if enough folks buy it here, Thrasher's Wheat will be able to actually hire someone to deal with our mailbox! Just kidding... about the hiring not the pre-order.)

Blu-Ray version list Price is $431.99 and Amazon.com has it for $301.99 (includes FREE with Super Saver Shipping, which helps a bit!!!). There is also a regular DVD version on Amazon for $240.99.

This title will be released on January 27, 2009.

(NOTE: It has been reported that Amazon pre-orders do not actually charge your credit card until the item ships. So if you're worried about a pre-order of the Archives never coming or canceled or delayed (and who wouldn't?!) then you will not have funds debuted).

Running time listed at 1,200 minutes -- 20 hours! But no track listing as of yet. But here's an approximate guess.

Here's the preview:

So will The Archives be released before Time Fades Away??? When we started the release TFA petition awhile back it seemed inconceivable. Yet, it might just happen.

Naturally, all this Blu-Ray stuff causes confusion as eddy eccoasked:

I was wonderin'----would any of you know--can you play a blu Ray disc on a regular DVD until one gets a Blu-Ray machine?

Here's an answer:

"All Blu-ray players are backward compatible to play DVDs. The Sony PS3 is considered to be the best BD player and it also has an ethernet port for Internet connection. In addition, the Sony PS3 is continually having updates, which are downloadable from the Internet for free. Many other players don't have this ability and are stuck with whatever firmware ships with the player.

Connecting to the Internet with the Archives Blu-ray set enables the owner to download (for free) new content whenever Neil makes it available. This could be music and video downloads, more archival materials, tour info and special offers.

The regular DVD edition is interactive as much as the Fillmore or Massey Hall DVDS were.

The major differences between the BD and DVD archive editions are that the BD version has 24/192 audio, a HD picture (which means EVERYTHING looks better), the ability to navigate thru the archives while the music plays, Blu-ray style pop up menus and advanced navigation.

Having tested both the DVDs and Blu-ray discs from this set, I can tell you that without a doubt the BD version blows away the DVD in every respect.

Thanks for the clarification Neil! ;)

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39 Comments:

At 10/28/2008 06:23:00 PM, Ben said...: In before price complaints. Take cover everybody!
At 10/28/2008 06:35:00 PM, Anonymous said...: Hollywood title Blu-ray discs sell for around $30 each.
With the Archives set you get 10 Blu-ray discs, a 250 page book, a poster, a cool custom box ...and the ability to download more in the future..for free.

What is there to complain about unless you are a whining hippie who only spends that kind of money on rock concerts and drugs?
At 10/28/2008 06:35:00 PM, Anonymous said...: Hell Ya. My advice t those who want it cheaperis to join the Borders Rewards program and wait for them to send you a coupon for 40% off all DVDs and Blu-Rays which they do about every 3 months or so. PLus shipping is free on orders that much.
At 10/28/2008 10:58:00 PM, Anonymous said...: regular dvd version available for pre-oder also--$240.00 amazon
At 10/28/2008 11:39:00 PM, LRR said...: I get the feeling that someone here has actually seen/used (and perhaps developed????) the Archives. So....gotta ask....You may have seen my attempt to decipher the tracklisting by staring at photos of "The Scroll" and the video playback from JavaOne. I've been able to pick out about 115 songs, of which 16 are unreleased. Am I about right, or is there more on there than what the Scroll suggests? Are there alternate versions in the folders I may not be able to see from just staring at the file cabinet? Is the Scroll outdated? Is there any live electric CSNY on there? Also, what's the track between "Alabama" and "Soldier"? It looks like "PhD" to me. Regards, LRR
At 10/29/2008 01:17:00 AM, Ian G said...: So what happened to the supposed problems with Blu Ray that were going to prevent its release?
At 10/29/2008 03:02:00 AM, Anonymous said...: Ha, ha, this is a good thing. Thrasher, thanks for the post and the copy of "Neil's text". It will take a while before all NY rusties will understand Blu-Ray. Therefore it's a good statement from Thrasher just to mention the price of the Blu-Ray only! The Archives is a Blu-Ray project by Neil. Not a DVD project. The DVD will be released because a lot of people don't own a Blu-Ray player and because Reprise wants it out on DVD as well. So, yes, in fact you can say Neil Young is a prisoner of Rock 'n' Roll for once... but then again the DVD is something he does for his fans too.
If you're still not sure about Blu-Ray please read the text by Neil at the top of this page a hundred times.

One more thing: the running time of 1200 minutes for the Blu-Ray isn't very accurate. If you go through all the stuff, read all the texts and articles, view all the movies etc. it will take you maybe something like 10.000 minutes or more. The Blu-Ray is not a movie you can watch by pressing the play button. It's a great adventure. B.S.M.
At 10/29/2008 03:29:00 AM, Anonymous said...: I thought they were to be released on CD/DVD i.e. CD's & DVD's??

What happened to that? I want to be able to put the archives on my ipod the same way I would with a regular CD.
At 10/29/2008 03:31:00 AM, Anonymous said...: Why aren't the Archives listed on Amazon UK too?
At 10/29/2008 03:42:00 AM, Anonymous said...: I've saved up about two hundred dollars worth of vouchers from my birthday and Christmas, so I'm ready to buy the blu-ray version if it comes out.
At 10/29/2008 05:54:00 AM, Anonymous said...: fuck you neil young
At 10/29/2008 07:39:00 AM, Anonymous said...: It just really sucks: THINK ABOUT IT: YOU CAN ONLY LISTEN TO THIS MUSIC ON YOUR TV OR COMPUTER? WHY? WHY CANT I PUT IT ON IN MY CAR? OR ON MY STEREO? OR EVEN BETTER: MY TURNTABLE! THERE SHOULD BE A VINYL EDITION FOR US VINYL NUTS WITH A BIG BOOK WERE WE CAN READ ALL THE STUFF THAT WOULD BE ON YOUR TV OR MONITOR? IM A YOUNG GUY AND I HAVE A TURNTABLE>>>AS IM SURN MOST REAL NEIL YOUNG FANS DO!JUST HAVING MIXED FEELINGS. IF I BUY THIS THING I HAVE TO BUY THE DVD VERSION AND IT JUST SUCKS THAT THERES A BETTER VERSION OF THE PRODUCT OUT THERE. I DONT HAVE A HIGH-DEF TV NOR CAN I PLAY BLUE RAY ON MY COMPUTER SO WHATS THE POINT? OK I'll GO OUT AND BUY A BLUE RAY PLAYER OR A PS3, A HIGH DEF TV AND THE ARCHIVES! SCREW THE KIDS, THE HOUSE, AND OIL FOR HEAT! I THINK NEIL TAKES FOR GRANTED THAT MOST PEOPLE DONT HAVE THE MONEY HE HAS! SURE HE MAY BE "DOING IT FOR HIMSELF!" BUT WITHOUT THE FANS WHO WOULD LET HIM! I DONT KNOW>>> VERY MIXED EMOTIONS HERE
At 10/29/2008 08:16:00 AM, Anonymous said...: Relax darling! If you love vinyl you should have noticed that all NY releases from the last couple of years have been released on vinyl by Classic Records.
One day the Archives will be on vinyl too. I hope so.
But do you have a record player in your car? www.classicrecords.com/
At 10/29/2008 08:25:00 AM, LRR said...: You may need to buy a new receiver too, depending upon what kind of blu ray player you get....Then again, you may not need to buy an HDTV at all....it all really depends on the player.

Do your homework.

I believe the PS3, with networking capability, also has a "composite video/ stereo audio cable", meaning that it can interface to your existing TV and stereo system. You just won't get the high def today.

To get the high def / surround sound and video you WILL have to upgrade your entire system to something with HDMI. Or be sure to get a player which decodes the high def signals out to 7/1 analog audio outputs and component video. Those exist, such as the new Sony BDP-S550. But then you might want to ensure you have a receiver with surround analog inputs. Ironically, really old AV receivers have these (back before decoders were a part of the receiver).

Clear as mud?

That's the bitch, it take some homework. But the PS3 IS the least costly "solution" for you to experience all of the Archives "Functionality" today, giving you the choice to upgrade the rest of your system at a later date.

Hope that helps.
At 10/29/2008 08:41:00 AM, FiL said...: Eddy ecco never actually answered the question. No, you can't play Blu-Ray discs on regular DVD players. They will only play on Blu-Ray players.
At 10/29/2008 08:42:00 AM, LRR said...: If you have an A/V receiver with optical inputs you might be fine for high def / 5.1 surround sound too with the PS3.
At 10/29/2008 08:44:00 AM, LRR said...: Does anyone know if the contents of the 250 page book are redundant with the "Archival Material" (ie, articles and photos") on the DVD/BD? Thanks.
At 10/29/2008 08:48:00 AM, LRR said...: Neil!!!! Pls update the Archives page on your website. That 8CD/2DVD thing sounds clearly outdated and is confusing for most folks that can't find the excellent Thrasher's Wheat! Thanks!
At 10/29/2008 08:54:00 AM, MARIAN M. said...: OK, now, everybody who was complaining about the Performance Series CD's also being part of Volume I of the Archives can now stop complaining and be thankful that they have the CD's.

Also, Volume I is on DVD for all those who do not have the equipment and/or budget for the Blu-Ray version.

Can't we all be happy that there is actually a release date? We've never had this before, and we've been waiting for over 20 years!

In the next two months, we get Sugar Mountain, Neil live in Concert, and Archives, Volume I. I'd say that's a lot to be thankful for!!!!!

47 days till Neil is at MSG!!!!!

Marian M.
At 10/29/2008 09:25:00 AM, Anonymous said...: Are they still coming out on CD as well as DVD & Blu-Ray?
At 10/29/2008 10:51:00 AM, Anonymous said...: Thrasher: you imply that Neil is blogging on your site!
Care to elaborate for us?

Seriously, Neil--will this be available as post holiday retail sales? Don't laugh man, it's call budgeting!

-Chicago
At 10/29/2008 10:57:00 AM, Anonymous said...: Neil's gone elitist ... I'm buying Bob's archives for typical cd prices..."the times they are a changin!"
At 10/29/2008 12:43:00 PM, Doug said...: Hello. As a Blu-Ray owner for about two years now, I can answer most of the questions you all have.

1)You don't need a new TV or stereo system to enjoy the Blu-Ray contents. All Blu-Ray players I know of can handle regular composite outputs. If worse comes to worse, get the PS3. I've hooked it up to several TVs over composite connections. The quality is poor compared to the full high-def experience but it does work.

2)The "ultimate" A/V connector for BR is called HDMI. One cable carries all the A/V content, along with the decryption signal (HDCP) that "unlocks" the highest A/V quality. (Long, technical story.) However, even without HDMI/HDCP, one can get a great-looking A/V setup with analog (or optical) audio outputs and component video cables. If you're confused by the audio portion, remember that just about all the content will probably be in mono or stereo, so you don't need to worry about terms like "5.1 surround sound" unless you're planning to watch other discs with surround sound audio tracks. (Don't worry about optical outputs either. They're primarily used for surround sound output and require A/V receivers anyway.) If you're confused by the video portion, composite connectors are the RCA connectors (almost always yellow) that replaced coax cables years ago, while component looks like composite but has three connectors for video. With a high-def TV, component allows you to obtain higher resolution video that is extremely close to, but not quite as good as, HDMI video.

3)Bottom-rung BR players should be available for $200 or less very soon. www.blu-ray.com is a good site that keeps an eye on sales and whatnot. I think there's actually a sale going on right now where you can get $100 off all Sony BR players, the PS3 included. I'm guessing that by this time next year, players will be breaking the $150 barrier, or maybe even $100.

4)If you want the downloadable content, you'll need to make sure that your BR player is "BD-Live" (aka "Profile 2.0") certified. Basically, BR has one "base" profile (1.0) that every disc must meet. In other words, no matter which player you own, you can watch and listen to the main content. However, for various reasons, there are two extra profiles: 1.1 ("BonusView") and 2.0. The former lets discs add certain extraneous features like picture-in-picture content. The latter primarily lets discs add Internet capabilities. If your player isn't certified for Profile 1.1, any content designed for profiles 1.1 or 2.0 will be unusable, at least in the intended manner. (The content might be viewable but in a different format.) If your player isn't certified for Profile 2.0, any content designed for profile 2.0 will be unusable.

5)Occasionally, players have trouble with certain discs, or manufacturers activate Profile 1.1 or 2.0 capabilities on certain players. To fix the problems or activate the features, one will have to download firmware updates from the manufacturers. (Think of the firmware as the "brain" that controls the player.) If a player is connected directly to the Internet, this is usually straightforward. If not connected, in all likelihood, you'll have to burn a CD with the update and place it in the player. Updates are important! Don't skip them! For technical reasons, I have a feeling the Archives series will really push players and possibly require updates. (If you're really curious, look up "BD-Java" and the challenges that some discs have caused. The "Pirates of the Caribbean" discs are great examples. For example, some players require(d) 2+ minutes just to get to the main menu, all because of the interactive features.)

6)It's difficult to explain without getting into technical goobledy-gook but I want to talk about Neil pimping the PS3. He's not just blowing smoke. The strength of the PS3 lies in its versatility. Yes, there are players with higher-end electronics. The problem is that a lot of players receive upgrades for awhile and are then ignored. The PS3, however, has received consistent attention from Sony ever since it was first released and will continue to receive attention for at least 2-3 more years. The firmware updates mentioned above are the key. These updates have enabled profiles 1.1 and 2.0, along with adding several other great features. The PS3 also lets you access content via a wireless network, unlike some BR players which require a wired connection. So, basically, the PS3 now handles everything listed above, with the exception of analog surround sound output. (It does have an optical audio output, though.)

7)Playing the discs on computers is a bit tricky. For now, you'll have to pay $100+ for a BR drive and obtain software (e.g., PowerDVD) that lets you play BRs. At the moment, this solution is pretty much limited to Windows, and you're faced with similar obstacles if you want the ultimate A/V quality (e.g., owning a HDCP-certified video card, which will set you back at least $75-100).

8)If you're the kind of person who likes to rip discs (hey, it'd be nice to convert that 24/192 audio to FLAC!), you may have problems with the BRs. At the moment, there's only one feasible solution. I won't mention it here, just in case the mods are touchy about such things, but sly people can easily find this software. Anyway. it's expensive and will require you to purchase a BR drive for your computer but it will let you copy the contents. I don't know offhand how well it works with ripping downloadable content, though. (Meanwhile, the DVD edition will be far easier to rip but the A/V content will be at lower resolutions.)

9)I hinted at this above but the BR edition will probably require some patience. If the preview is any indication, Neil's trying hard to push the envelope of what BR can do. I can almost guarantee that some players will have difficulty playing portions of the discs, or even playing the discs at all. This will require firmware updates for some players. (The DVD edition, meanwhile, shouldn't pose problems.)

I hope this helps! If you have any more questions, I highly recommend going over to the forum at www.blu-ray.com and, after viewing any "newbie" threads, asking questions. I've found them to be helpful, although you might have to ask them to dial back the technical jargon.
At 10/29/2008 12:48:00 PM, Doug said...: Oh, and I'd like to add an addendum. When it comes to the video, I seriously doubt there will be much difference between the DVD and Blu-Ray in some cases. If material was shot on film and "transferred" at high definition, or if the material was shot using high-def video cameras (pretty much only recent material), then yes, BR will definitely look better. If the material was shot using standard definition video cameras, there will be very little, if any, difference. There are technical reasons why BR might look better but I don't want to overload you all. ;)

So, yeah, BR is the way to go if you can afford it. I'm just saying that content not "optimized" for the high def experience won't get a magical boost just because it's on BR.
At 10/29/2008 01:56:00 PM, Anonymous said...: Doug, Thank you so much!
At 10/29/2008 04:00:00 PM, Anonymous said...: Holy crap! If there are five volumes of the archives coming out at $300 bucks each thats $1500 dollars. Does anyone else think thats a ridiculous amount of money? Just give me cds, i only want to hear the music
At 10/29/2008 05:51:00 PM, Anonymous said...: Hmmm.... If one were to invest that same $1500 into the stock market....?

Any tips?

-Chicago
At 10/29/2008 05:53:00 PM, Anonymous said...: I agree with the post above mine, its great that they are coming out on Blu-ray and all but are they also going to be released on normal cd's too? How are we supposed to get the music on our ipods? I was hoping that there would be unreleased stuff such as TFA finally released with a proper case so it can sit nicely alongside the rest of my collection.

NEIL, PLEASE PUT THE ARCHIVES OUT ON REGULAR CD TOO!
At 10/29/2008 07:29:00 PM, Anonymous said...: Unlikely to sell that many sets given the price and format. I'll pass as I have survived this long without it. Sugar Mountain release will be just fine.
At 10/29/2008 11:01:00 PM, Anonymous said...: Well, it's like McCartney said in the song "Monkberry Moon Delight"...."Catch up cats and kittens! Don't get left behind!" I would personally like to thank everyone for all the positive info about Blu-Ray. I'm gonna catch up with all this new stuff, Garfong out and sit back and trip back to early Neil come January. After all,some people say, winter is the best of all.
At 10/29/2008 11:46:00 PM, Anonymous said...: Well, its not that hard to turn on the TV and chuck on the blu-ray and have a few beers while you chill out and listen to Neil. What better place to do it than in your lounge room? Listening to the Archives on an iPod or in the car doesn't sound very appealing to me. I like having a special time and place for music, and that's while I'm at home, and not while I'm running around with heaps of other distractions. And as for the price, everyone could have saved up a lot by now if they wanted it. You've had since 1989. I've put aside some money so i can buy it. And I've also asked for music vouchers for my birthday and for Christmas. Getting vouchers is a great way of cutting down the cost, so you might want to consider that. Anyway, that's all for now.
At 10/30/2008 01:08:00 AM, Anonymous said...: Doug- thank you for some great, factual and informative comments. You have hit many of the key points about Blu-ray and how it relates to the Archives release. This is the kind of communication that can clear much of the confusion about Blu-ray and how it relates to the Archives set.

Some of the key points in your remarks are:
1- this release is pushing the envelope on a relatively new format.
2- a quality player that can have firmware updates is useful for any Blu-ray owner and especially for owners of the Archives. Look for a profile 2.0 player when shopping.
3- simply putting down some cash for a cheap Blu-ray player for your computer isn't going to ensure you a happy experience. Do you have sound card that supports 192kHz audio in your computer?

Finally-there is a great difference in picture quality between the DVD and Blu-ray editions of the Archives. Film sources were transfered in hi def and new materials were shot or created in hi def.

We should keep this thread going and help one another understand the formats, their capabilites and how owners of the Archives can enjoy the set without fear, worry or complaining.

At time the trepidation over accessibility and use of the Archives set seems like a conversation between 80 year olds wondering if they will still be able to watch TV after the switchover to digital next year. :-)
At 10/30/2008 07:04:00 PM, Anonymous said...: I'm having some reservations about Bluray after reading this:
http://blogs.zdnet.com/storage/?p=365&tag=nl.e550
At 10/30/2008 09:03:00 PM, TheDrunkenAngel said...: i will purchase the archives on every format. i will consider it an investment. i will need to eat beans for a while after the purchase. i will not be surprised if this turns out to be delayed.
At 10/30/2008 11:05:00 PM, Anonymous said...: Amazon have today added a CD version of Archives to their Neil Young page although it does not have a confirmed release date unlike the Blu-Ray and DVD versions.
At 10/31/2008 12:13:00 AM, Joe Tetreau said...: I'm still holding out hope that the DVD and Blu-ray versions will include digital files to burn CDs with along with artwork for them. For that price, why not?

Oh, and there are already 2 customer reviews on Amazon.com by people who haven't seen and heard the item they reviewed. (Big problem with Amazon, actually.) But the complaints about pre-ordering without seeing a tracklist are ridiculous. You can cancel your order at anytime prior to the release date with no penalty. You're not charge until the item is shipped. So what's the risk? I'm willing to bet there will be a lot more info available before they start shipping sets out...
At 10/31/2008 12:31:00 AM, Doug said...: Hello. I just wanted to respond to a couple of comments.

10/30, 12:08 AM
"3- simply putting down some cash for a cheap Blu-ray player for your computer isn't going to ensure you a happy experience. Do you have sound card that supports 192kHz audio in your computer?"

This is true, and one reason why using a computer is a bit dicey. My computer actually can handle 24/192 audio but I built it four months ago for $2000. Not that a 24/192-capable computer must cost that much but your average Dell would probably reduce the resolution. That and there can be issues with digital audio output on computers but that's a whole other story.

10/30, 6:04 PM
"http://blogs.zdnet.com/storage/?p=365&tag=nl.e550"

This guy does raise some good points but he blatantly ignores the fact that DVD was in a similar position when it was only two years old. In fact, I almost went off on a tangent about the cost of Blu-Ray players compared to DVD when I originally posted. I bought my first standalone DVD player almost three years after they were first introduced. It was a no-name from China and it costed $200. There may have been cheaper players but not by much. So, if BR really is down to $150 right now, it's actually ahead of DVD.

Also, regarding authoring costs and royalties, it's the same story. In the beginning, DVD production was only for the big boys. Over time, anybody could play along. BR will probably fall in a similar boat. Yes, there are some issues, but most can be overcome. Again, look at DVD. First, it was the Hollywood studios ('97). Then, it was the smaller labels ('98-'00). Finally, it was the true indies ('00-'01). BR is following a similar trajectory.

Look at it this way. Even if BR somehow fails, you'll still have a perfectly fine DVD player. DVD's not going anywhere anytime soon. So, a BR player is a pretty safe investment.

I could say a lot more but I have to get up early, so I'll spare you all. ;) Good night.
At 10/31/2008 12:42:00 AM, Doug said...: Okay, one more post about that ZDNet article. There's a great web site called The Digital Bits (www.thedigitalbits.com). Bill Hunt, the guy who runs it, is very sharp and good at cutting through the BS using relatively simple terminology. He just posted a great rebuttal to the piece. http://forums.highdefdigest.com/1258119-post37.html is one place where you can read it. (I'll link to Bill's site but the piece will move very soon.)

Don't worry. BR is doing just fine and will continue to do well for quite awhile. With that, I really am off to bed! Later, gators.
At 10/31/2008 08:50:00 AM, Anonymous said...: Its £000.01 on HMV.co.uk - that's ONE PENNY - both Blu-Ray and DVD.

Surely they would have to honour this...?

http://hmv.com/hmvweb/displayProductDetails.do?ctx=12;5;218;-1;34&sku=833580

D'oh, actually, when you try to add it to your basket, it won't let you! :-)

http://hmv.com/hmvweb/displayProductDetails.do?ctx=280;-1;-1;-1;-1&sku=833586